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Scaling Clean Podcast

Episode 45: Clean Energy’s Moment of Reckoning—and the People Who Still Build

July 1, 2025

 

 

The Clean Energy Transition Needs Builders: A Conversation with MBL Energy CEO, Robert Laubach

Clean Energy’s Skilled Labor Shortage—and One EPC Leader’s Family Legacy

Right now, the clean energy industry is staring down a difficult moment. Trump’s Big Bad Budget bill eliminates key clean energy incentives, threatening gigawatts of clean energy poised to power the grid. The policy pendulum is swinging, and companies across cleantech are bracing for impact.

My guest on the latest episode of Scaling Clean, Robert Laubach, knows what it’s like to weather industry headwinds. In his words:

“We’ve gotten a lot of solar whiplash over the years. But you just keep going. You keep building.”

Robert is the CEO of MBL Energy, a California-based solar EPC contractor that has designed and installed over 800 megawatts of commercial and industrial solar energy projects. He brings more than 25 years of experience in commercial roofing and solar construction, and today, three generations of his family work together in the business.

This episode isn’t just about how to build a successful solar EPC company. It’s about resilient leadership, family legacy, and navigating the clean energy transition in a rapidly changing environment.

MBL Energy has delivered high-impact projects like solar canopies over hospital parking structures, EV charging infrastructure for commercial vehicle fleets, and even solar arrays installed over aqueducts—a growing trend in dual-use infrastructure. As Robert puts it:

“We’ll do as much or as little as needed to make our customers successful—from blank dirt to final delivery.”

What stood out in our conversation wasn’t just Robert’s technical expertise. It was his deep respect for skilled trades and his unshakable belief that building things still matters. One stat struck me:

For every 5 skilled tradespeople retiring, only 2 are entering the field.

The Skilled Labor Gap

On the skilled labor gap, I want to share an excerpt of our conversation, because this point is personal for me. 

Melissa: “Do you feel like there are enough skilled tradespeople in the cleantech and solar industry?”

Robert Laubach: “No, absolutely not. There's a major gap. The skilled labor force is aging. There's not enough being done to attract young people to the trades. I think education hasn't prioritized the trades in a way that points to how satisfying and how respectable the trades are.

I am blue collar through and through. There's five people retiring out of the trades for every two new hires that are coming in at this moment.

A huge gap in not just the head count, but you're only one generation away from losing the soft skills that get passed down in the field working side by side with somebody who's been doing it for 20 years.

In our business, what I've also noticed is that the technical aptitude of our field installers is mind blowing. What these folks can do in building and troubleshooting and understanding how things work is a master's class that I think society does not fully recognize.

There's so much of this younger generation that wants to watch it on a YouTube reel or thinks that is how you generate revenue or a career. I'd put some of our field installers up against some of the smartest engineers in the industry who don't know which side of the hammer to hold — it works on paper, but this isn't how it really works.

And so I would love for our society to value the honest day's work. I love blue collar.”

Robert’s point hit home for me. I grew up in a blue-collar family. My father worked at the Goodyear rubber factory in Akron, Ohio, building race car tires and air springs. I remember the grease on his hands and the union picnics at Turkeyfoot Lake. It made an impression on me, and I saw firsthand the pride my dad had in doing an honest day’s work.

In our rush toward innovation, I worry we’re leaving that legacy behind. Don’t get me wrong, there’s value in all types of work. But the pressure we put on kids to earn a college degree may have steered generations of talented people away from the trades we now urgently need.

Three Big Points from Robert Laubach

Evolving Technology Demands: Solar Alone Isn’t Enough Anymore
Time stamp 19:09 - The days of simple net metering are over. Today’s projects require solar, storage, EV integration and more.

“The idea of ‘arriving’ doesn’t resonate with me. It’s hard to steer a parked car. If you're not progressing, you're getting left behind.”

“The days of just running the meter backwards to save on power bills are long gone—especially in California. Now, what customers need are full solutions: solar, battery storage, EV charging infrastructure, and smart behind-the-meter systems.”

Leadership Means Facing the Tough Conversations
Time stamp 21:25 - Great leadership isn’t just about vision or scale, it’s about being willing to have the hard conversations and lead people through difficult moments.

“The best way out of something is just through it. Pick up the phone. Talk to people. Don’t hide behind email. That’s how you get things done.”

The Human Element Still Matters Most
Time stamp 23:27 - In a world obsessed with credentials and automation, Robert reminds us that character and attitude often matter more than raw skill.

“Attitude, not aptitude, determines altitude.”

It’s a simple phrase, but it reflects Robert’s hiring philosophy: look for people who care, who contribute to the team, and who bring a sense of purpose to their work. Skills can be trained. Character can’t.

That’s what this episode is really about: resilience, legacy, and the people who do the hard work of building our critical energy infrastructure.

 

Also listen on Apple, Spotify, Radio Public, Amazon Music, and iHeart.

This blog post is part of the Scaling Clean series by Tigercomm, a marketing and PR firm specializing in clean energy, climate tech, and sustainability.

Visit the Scaling Clean blog for more episodes, or contact us to learn how we help clean economy companies grow faster.

Overview

Introduction

Melissa Baldwin:

All right, my next guest brings over 25 years of experience in construction. Robert Laubach is the CEO of MBL Construction, an EPC based in San Jose, California, that specializes in the design and construction of solar projects. MBL has designed and installed over 800 megawatts of CNI projects, which are commercial and industrial projects across the country. And what we found particularly interesting about Robert's company is that he has three generations of family working in the solar business together. And we're going to talk more about that today. We want to give a shout-out to our listener, Scott Ameduri, president of Enerlogics, for referring Robert to Scaling Clean. Robert, thanks for joining the Scaling Clean podcast.

Robert Laubach:

Thank you for having me.

What It Took to Build MBL: Robert Laubach’s Story

Melissa Baldwin

Tell me the journey that landed you in the role as CEO.

Robert Laubach

I was a business management major in college. And after I graduated, I went to work in my father's commercial roofing business as a sales and project manager estimator. I guess early on, I carried a sense of insecurity about being kind of the second generation in the business. I felt that it was kind of essential that my performance and kind of attention to detail go beyond reproach, to dispel any perception of entitlement, which probably was my own insecurity more than anything.

That particular business went through a consolidation that ultimately led to the closure of the company because its operating line of credit was with a bank that was heavily invested in the airline industry. And then 9/11 happened.

And so, at that point in time, I was faced with a decision. I had a young family to support. I have four boys, all grown now. But I had to choose between rebuilding from scratch or pursuing a more traditional corporate path in business. And that's when we chose to found both a new commercial roofing business, along with, at the time, what was a boutique company called MBL and Sons.

We didn't necessarily have a clear vision for MBL other than my dad had a strong belief that there was something coming in the rising demand for energy efficiency generation back then in the roofing business. It was when Title 24 and cool roofing building envelope designs were starting to get some traction, particularly in the state of California. And so we took a very sort of practical approach of, if you're going to use your building as a place to generate power, better do it right and make sure your roof doesn't leak.

And that's kind of what got us started in the business. And since then, we watched the definition of big get bigger. And now, better part of 23 years into operating the business, it's kind of makes us a dinosaur as far as how long we've been in the sort of design, build space for solar.

The Origins of MBL: Getting Ahead of Energy Efficiency and Early Solar

Melissa Baldwin

Do I have it correct that, so essentially your dad started a business and it was a roofing business first, and then you added on the efficiency and solar pieces? Is that right?

Robert Laubach

No, so he didn't start the roofing business. Myself and a handful of guys that used to work for my dad in the late 80s and through the 90s, we started the roofing business. And at the time, he didn't want to be a contractor anymore. And then here we are, 23 years later.

No, it was more the idea of MBL and Sons. He and myself and my mom are saying we see something coming. At the time, it was daylighting and skylights on buildings. It was cool roofs. We did the very first ever installation of Uni-Solar, which was the thin-film flexible solar panel. We were willing to innovate and try things differently.

And the first year, we did like three jobs. And then the second year, we did 15. And because we had access to the operating workforce at the roofing company, I cross-trained some of our installers to be able to sort of build solar. And so it allowed our MBL development team, which was Mark and me, to be pretty elastic. We didn't have a burn rate, and we could win a job, go through the design permitting development process, and have the workforce available to go build it when the time came.

Melissa Baldwin

I have a follow-up question on that. You said your dad saw something coming. I'm curious, do you feel like customers were asking for this? Was it a top-up, customer-driven approach, or do you feel like the policies and incentives were driving some of that demand?

Robert Laubach

I think it came from both directions, and it made sense. If you had the ability to generate your own power at your facility where it was getting consumed, it made a lot of sense.

Keep in mind that the incentive at the time when we started was $4.50, a lot, right? So, in the end, the economics of solar were the big driver to adaptation.

We were introduced through BT to Jigger Shaw before Sun Evanescent was ever sort of started. And the concept of a PPA and, you know, at the time, I had designed and permitted a project for him before SunEdison ever existed for an IKEA store in Emeryville. I had it fully permitted. And in the end, the project didn't end up going. But we networked into the sort of emerging energy space in a pretty effective way.

That was a skill that my dad was pretty strong with, finding and building relationships for new opportunities.

Melissa Baldwin

Yeah, good person to know, Jigger Shaw. That's incredible.

Robert Laubach

I still have the permit in a binder.

Melissa Baldwin

Nice, an IKEA store too. They've got a huge roof, it makes a ton of sense.

Robert Laubach

Yeah, it took it. It ended up being 15 years before it actually got built there because at the time, the bank wanted to see the contract to fund it, and the customer wanted to see the money before they signed the contract. And so the whole thing stalled out. And I sat there holding the permit, going, I guess we're not building this.

The Beacon Clip: Solving a Commercial Roofing Problem at Scale

Melissa Baldwin

But I'm ready when you are, right? Nice. I'm going to move to another question. I noticed that you have a patent on a technology called the Beacon Clip. What is that? Is there a story behind that?

Robert Laubach

It kind of came out of my experience in the commercial roofing business, particularly because we used to design and engineer mechanical roof screens, the fences that you build on roofs to block the view of the air conditioners, as a requirement for planning departments.

At the time in 2003, that experience made us realize that there had to be a practical way to build solar on a roof that didn't compromise the watertight integrity of the building. There were no major solar racking systems on the market at the time. And canopies, even then, were very much uncharted territory, which has since become the bread and butter of what we design and build, particularly in the state of California.

And it became clear that we needed to securely and efficiently attach solar modules in a commercial application that's much different than residential. It's one thing to do a handful of nuts and bolts, but if you have to do thousands of them over and over again, there's got to be a better way.

So it was out of that that we developed and tested the Beacon Clip, which is effectively a way to mount a module to a structural purlin. Eventually, it became the attachment that we used on the very first DSA pre-check in the state of California. The state architect is the permitting authority for all public schools. And so we kind of innovated with, at the time, Chevron Energy to get a pre-designed canopy for public schools.

So since then, we've secured, shoot, I think it's 2 and 1/2 million solar modules with the clip.

Melissa Baldwin

Wow. Wow. That's incredible. And what is DSA? You used an acronym there. What is that?

Robert Laubach

It's the Division of State Architects. So it is the California Permitting Authority for all schools, through junior college.

Mentors and Servant Leadership: Lessons from Family and Long-Time Advisors

Melissa Baldwin

Okay. Who were your mentors? Who were the people who influenced you? And what have you learned from them?

Robert Laubach

Sure, and I have a lot of dad quotes. And the older I get, the more fun they are. But I guess first and foremost is Mark, my dad. We started the business together. He passed away in 2014, way too young. I wouldn't be who I am without him. He was a man of God. He had tremendous character. He wasn't always successful. He dreamed big and failed hard at times.

Robert Laubach

He didn't teach in bullet points or business principles. He kind of taught by example. And the one thing that I aspire to that I'll never fill the shoes is that he cared about people. He believed in them. He had a kind of visionary mindset. But in the end, he was more interested in you as a person than whether he ever did a transaction with you. And because of that, you know,

It's something that has impacted me greatly when it comes to dealing with situations. I, on the other hand, am very much more of an executor. I'm a list guy, and I do blocking and tackling well. So I guess we made a good team.

The second one is a gentleman named Michael Lamb. And I currently work with him every day. Talked to him this morning twice.

He's the president of a company called New Power Partners. He's been around the solar industry for decades. He was a practicing attorney for a while. He's an electrical engineer. He's not an employee of MBL, but he's always been 100 % available to me, first as a friend and then kind of as an advisor. He was originally introduced to me by my dad. I'm not sure how he even met Michael, but he's somebody that to this day, I can be vulnerable with.

That sounds kind of odd, but it's true. And he always asks me, hey, how can I help? So I would say both he and my father shared that same sort of servant leadership mindset. And those would be the two folks that I would say are important mentors to me personally, and really the trajectory of the business.

Melissa Baldwin

You said something that reminds me of some other conversations I've had. This concept of servant leadership has come up quite a bit in these interviews. When you say servant leadership, what does that mean to you?

Robert Laubach

So in its simplest form, don't ask anybody to do anything that you wouldn't be willing to do yourself. And back to the dadisms, you should always be excited when good things happen to other people. And it's easy for people to say that, but it's a behavioral discipline.

And when you do that, and you run a people-centric business, you've got to do it together.

A Multi-Generational Family Business: Working with Mom and the Next Generation

Melissa Baldwin

I love it. I love what you just said. That's great. Cool. I'm going to keep going. So, MBL, you've talked about as a family-owned business, and Barbara, your mother, is the president. What's it like to work with and for your mom?

Robert Laubach

Yeah, so she's actually our CEO. I mean, our CFO. Barb's our CFO. Yeah, and she and I have always worked well together. We're both very task-oriented. She was the polar opposite of my father. She's very focused on the behind-the-scenes responsibilities, payroll, bookkeeping, and cash management. She really helps create the financial clarity that we need to lead well.

She's a bookkeeper at heart, and I'd say her precision has kind of shaped our back office culture. You add Jim Coates, who is our COO and was effectively our fourth employee, into the mix. He's equally as precise in the way he manages field resources.

Melissa Baldwin

And is there anybody else in the family who's involved in the company?

Robert Laubach

Yeah, so I had mentioned that I had four boys, Colby, Trent, Chase, and Troy. So there's the C's and the T's. Colby has been a project manager and kind of the glue to sort of back office and operations for, I think, he's going on seven years.

And then the other C has been a construction manager for us, and he ran our traveling crew. So for the past five years, he's lived in an RV all over the country, running jobs in New Jersey, Florida, and San Diego. And he's traversed the country and learned a lot. And then Trent joined our team. He used to be in software sales to run and manage our O division just six months ago. So yeah, we're in the third generation.

Melissa Baldwin

That's incredible.

Leading Through Uncertainty: Shared Responsibility in Tough Times

Melissa Baldwin

Well, I'm going to move on to another section of the interview on leadership and company challenges. So one big part of the CEO's job is to lead with confidence. Has there ever been a moment when you weren't sure that the business would survive? And how did you handle that?

Robert Laubach

Yeah, there have been many moments of doubt during economic downturns, policy shifts, labor force issues, all of those sorts of things. I would say, though, that failure was never sort of an option in a family business where your mission is basically to provide jobs for people to support their families. Our mindset has kind of always been that everything's figure-outable.

In the end, we build things, and there will always be a need for something to be built. Ironically, I don't see confidence as a display of bravado. I kind of wake up most days feeling under-qualified for the role I'm in. I think confidence is built when your team knows you'll stand with them shoulder to shoulder.

Through the decisions that need to be made, and more importantly, whatever the consequences are. We own those together, whether they're good or bad.

Melissa Baldwin

I love that visual, standing shoulder to shoulder with your team. And is there anything else, anything you'd follow on to that, for when you face tough times, and right now the industry is staring in the face of major potential consequences and legislation changes, any guidance that you would give to other people in the industry?

Robert Laubach

Tomorrow will take care of itself. We have enough problems today. And if we're going to focus on what might happen, I honestly think that in your mind, that can be debilitating if you spend too much time worrying about things you can't control.

There's an unquenchable appetite for power that is accelerating exponentially as we speak and over the past few years. And you're never going to put the solar genie back in the box, regardless of, I mean, I've done this for 23 years, and I've lived through the risk of the ITC expiring at least three times.

Where we were going, asses and elbows to build stuff before the end of the year when the ITC was going to end. And then five minutes before New Year's, it got re-extended. And then we had no work from January to April because everybody stopped and started. So we've gotten a lot of solar whiplash over the years. And what we've learned is keep the hand to the plow.

Evolving Customer Needs: From Standalone Solar to Integrated Energy Solutions

Melissa Baldwin

The opposite of that question I just asked, has there ever been a moment where it really hit home that you're going to succeed, that you've really got something here, that things are going to go well? Can you describe that moment and how you felt?

Robert Laubach

Yeah. So honestly, the idea of arriving doesn't particularly resonate with me. On that sort of humility matrix, it means that you kind of always have to be striving for what's next. If you're not progressing, you're kind of getting left behind. It's very difficult to steer a parked car.

So yes, we've been blessed. And as a company, we're kind of more focused on just doing good work. And out of that comes innovation, because necessity is the mother of invention. And so if we stay faithful to the tasks at hand, there's a higher likelihood of success, right? Chance favors the prepared, they say.

And so while we haven't arrived, there are times where it's like, hey, I'm really, in retrospect, very proud of what our team's done and how we've worked through problems.

I mean, one of our big challenges these days is that the grid just can't handle our customers' need for energy. And so the days of just building solar and running the meter backwards to save you on a power bill are long gone, especially in the state of California.

So now what we're finding is customers and circumstances where we have to be solution-based in our approach with our customers, whether they're end users, whether they're financiers, or whether they're developers. And that means solar. It means storage. It means managing EV. It means building smart, behind-the-meter solutions at a much larger scale than what you would see at a house.

Success is not an end game. I think it's a result of working hard.

Handling Difficult Conversations and Knowing When to Say No

Melissa Baldwin

My next question is around difficult conversations. So in business, CEOs have to have difficult conversations. This might be firing someone or addressing a mistake that's been made. Do you have any advice for how to handle difficult conversations? Or what has your experience been?

Robert Laubach

That's the biggest part of my job. If you have a strong team of managers, and in our case, design and delivery, there's always tug and pull and issues and circumstances that have to be overcome. My responsibility almost always centers around managing the hard conversations.

And sometimes seeing the forest through the trees a little bit in that, we really want to die on this hill? And tapping into the history of, well, here's how we faced that issue before, and here's how it was resolved. Maybe that or a version of that would be a better way to solve the problem. Whether it's a tough client or unexpected project risk, or financial stress.

I've learned, I think, that the hardest part is often in your mind. The best way out of something is just through it.

Melissa Baldwin

I agree with you completely. One more question under this category. Success relies mostly on what you choose not to do or what you choose to do. Which is it, in your opinion?

Robert Laubach

Well, I think both matter. But what you don't do is probably more important. There's an antigen construction. Don't fear the job you lost. Fear the one you won that you shouldn't have. And so that's why knowing what fits your strategy and what your resources are capable of doing and having the wisdom to say no is critical to prevent you from getting into a place that's hard to get out of.

Melissa Baldwin

I love that. I have not heard that saying in construction, but it makes perfect sense.

Why We Value Character Over Skill When Hiring

Melissa Baldwin

All right, let's move on to the next section. This is on hiring and team management. So we found that interviewing has been cited as one of the most challenging parts of leading a company. Your company has quadrupled over a period of four years, and construction is notorious for turnover. So what have you learned about making new hires? Any advice that you would share with our listeners?

Robert Laubach

It is the hardest part of the business. And I think I've mentioned that we don't sell widgets or software. We sell construction services. So hiring people with character seems to be the highest sort of priority. And it's not exact. No matter how hard you try, there's a batting average. And I mean, frankly, we look for the give-a-shit factor. Is there something in this person that cares, that genuinely cares about making a contribution to what the team is trying to accomplish, rather than being self-absorbed with what is in it for me?

Because if you focus on what's best for the team, the boats rise with the tide.

Attitude, not aptitude, determines altitude.

Melissa Baldwin

I like that. It's another saying I haven't heard yet. You are full of them, Robert. I'm glad. Now I know why Scott wanted us to interview you. This is really good. All right. Let's have the opposite of that question, then. Any advice that you have on firing?

Robert Laubach

It's never easy, especially if you're building a people-first culture. It's probably in the long term what's best for them and for the company.

Melissa Baldwin

Yeah, I feel you. One more question, a follow-up question on the interviewing part. Do you have a go-to interview question?

Robert Laubach

I have a go-to interview concept, which is to ask people about their lives, their family, their faith, and their hobbies. I think you can learn so much about their values if you get them to open up about what's important to them personally.

Melissa Baldwin

Alright. One more question on hiring and growing teams. Do you feel like there are enough skilled tradespeople in our industry?

Robert Laubach

OK, no, absolutely not. There's a major gap. The skilled labor force is aging. There's not enough being done to attract young people to the trades. I think education hasn't prioritized the trades in a way that points to how satisfying and how respectable the trades are.

There are five people retiring out of the trades for every two new hires that are coming in at this moment.

You're only one generation away from losing the soft skills that get passed down in the field, working side by side with somebody who's been doing it for 20 years.

Melissa Baldwin

Right now, there's a need, and there's a call to action to make things here in America, and that requires getting your hands dirty.

AI in Construction: A Tool, Not a Substitute for Human Judgment

Melissa Baldwin

I'm going to move to the next section here on marketing and AI. What is your approach to AI? What is, does your company have a policy on AI? Are you incorporating it into your business and how you do business or in what you sell?

Robert Laubach

I would say that our younger team members are pushing the AI adoption more. I've tried to create a culture of what I've coined intrapreneurship.

Which is, hey, guys, you guys are smart, and you have this ambition and aptitude to want to create. But if you own and run a business as an entrepreneur, 50% of your time is wasted doing all the stupid stuff that you have to do to run a business: labor compliance, filing your taxes, dealing with bank loans and financing, and how you manage all the government regulations that are necessary to even be allowed to mow your lawn.

In the environment of MBL, we're going to take care of all that because we've been doing it for 25 years. You can be creative under that umbrella. So, any idea you have, bring it to us. We'll kick it around.

I mean, that's how the vast majority of our vertical integration and new business initiatives have incubated, which is, hey, you know, we could do this ourselves, you know, whether it's shop welding and field fabrication, whether it's O services, whether it's even some proprietary energy storage software that we've gotten ourselves into by necessity.

So I put AI in that same bucket, which is: if you can find a way to make it work, then let's do it.

Marketing Through Trust: Why Reputation Matters More Than Promotion

Melissa Baldwin

All right, one more question on marketing and AI. So I was looking at your site, and I found a quote. I'm going to read that quote here for our listeners:

‘It is a great deal better to live with integrity than to talk about it. We are told to let our light shine. And if it does, we won't need to tell anybody it does. Lighthouses don't fire cannons to call attention to their shining. They just shine.’

And that quote's from Dwight L. Moody. So with that in context, I'm curious to hear about your company's approach to marketing. Do you have somebody on your team who's working on it full-time, or what marketing tactics have you found to be successful for your business?

Robert Laubach

So that lighthouse principle of let your light shine, and if it does, you won't need to shout about it, is a foundation for who we are and how we ended up where we're at: to just do good work, and make your good better and your better great. It's why our logo is the lighthouse.

80% of our work is repeat business. And while energy deployment in solar is faster than building a natural gas-fired plant, the things we're doing today, I started working on two to three years ago. So from a construction perspective, the development and sales cycle is very long.

If you're a specialty subcontractor as an electrician, a roofer, or a concrete guy, it might take you three to nine months to find a project, bid the project, win it, and go build it. Solar is very much a drawn-out pre-construction and development process. By the time we get to building it, it's kind of the easy part. So a lot of MBL's expertise is from opportunity to mobilization.

Melissa Baldwin

And I want to, you said the construction cycle is a long one. Was it one to three years, two to four years, or 18 months?

Robert Laubach

Yeah, it's kind of all over the map. The long pole in the tent, by the time we get a signed EPC contract, is really permitting, and some large equipment, transformers, and switch gear that are exponentially longer post-COVID to get spec'd and designed and get sort of on order for delivery.

So those things, on top of managing the cost of capital, a lot of projects stalled out waiting to see what interest rates would do because so much of solar is either off-balance-sheet financing or has certain hurdle rates that you have to be able to navigate.

And then you throw in tariffs, and what's going to happen with module costs and steel prices. And everybody wants to know what it costs to build it, which I can tell you today what it's going to cost to build it, but I'm not going to build it for a year. So, how do you want to handle that when you need a fixed cost to build it in order to clear the financial hurdles?

So it is that dance that keeps our heart rate up.

Learning and Motivation: Staying Grounded Through Industry Ups and Downs

Melissa Baldwin

Yeah, and so especially with so much uncertainty and so many unknowns and things change, you know, over time.

Melissa Baldwin

I'm personally curious to hear, do you have a favorite professional development book, podcast, or anything where you are currently drawing inspiration and learning from? Is there anything that you would recommend to others and our listeners?

Robert Laubach

Well, that's good. So what's funny is, early on in 1988, 1989, my dad took me to a Zig Ziglar conference, who was the only inspirational thing I ever went to. And it just stuck with me. I read all his books. There was a concept there. There was his performance planner that I used for years, where I would kind of grade myself on, am I doing, am I putting time into these eight different things that mattered.

And so I was walking through the airport like a year ago, and I saw that Tom, his son, had written another book that was off of that. And I read it, and it kind of brought me back to those early lessons. They're just kind of simple truths that it was fun to revisit.

And what's funny is there are certain principles in life that transcend time, right? And they really are good personal discipline. Don't get too high with the highs or too low with the lows. Put the time into the things that matter. Urgent things aren't always important, and important things aren't always urgent.

That's one that I've had to often figure out, is you can get bombarded with, we need to deal with this, we need to deal with this. And then you get to the end of the day, and you didn't work on the things that moved just a degree here or there that can change the trajectory.

Melissa Baldwin

And one more question, though, like how do you keep your team motivated through tough cycles? So you've been around a while. You've seen the roller, you rode the solar coaster, ups and downs. What do you do to keep your team motivated when there are questions ahead?

Robert Laubach

Share the weight. Kind of, we win together, we lose together. And when leadership stands with the team, I think morale follows.

Melissa Baldwin

I hear you. Has the work that you've done here, has it left you a climate optimist or a climate pessimist, and why?

Robert Laubach

So I'm just an optimist by nature. Even with the kind of policy headwinds and market volatility, there's just always going to be a need for companies like MBL: boots on the ground, execution, get the job done.

We've always joked that we're a construction company that happens to build renewable energy. And if we weren't building that, we'd be building something else.

I do love the fact that what we build is entirely energy-focused. We're not a division of a big consolidated electrical firm that has a renewables division. We eat, breathe, and live this stuff all day, every day. And so there's a certain level of passion around the business, and we are very unique.

Closing Thoughts: Leaving Things Better for the Next Generation

Melissa Baldwin

Anything else that you would add for our listeners?

Robert Laubach

My hope would be that when you think of MBL, you think of regular people working hard and trying to leave things better than when we started. And so now there's a fourth generation of boys that are coming into this world. I'm hoping that the third generation doesn't mess it up for them.

Melissa Baldwin

I can tell it's going to go well. I really enjoyed the conversation with you, Robert. You're so humble, and yet you're full of wisdom. I'm really glad that we took time to get to know you better.